When is Comedy Offensive?

From our DearBubbie on Facebook Archives:

Dear Bubbie:

‎"I have a friend who jokes about EVERYTHING - nothing is off-limits. From the oil-spill to alzheimer's. He has lost several Facebook friends because of it. I'm offended by some of his jokes (others are truly funny, though). He said he doesn't mean any harm. Is he right or socially unacceptable? He does want to try Amateur Night at our local comedy club, so I don't want to discourage him."
Signed, A friend

__________________________________________________________________

Sarah
They are Jokes. Does he only joke about one particular subject or is everyone and everything an equal target for his jokes??I wouldn't be offended unless I felt he was targeting one group/sub-group. I've heard plenty of Jokes about these topics you mentioned, many were funny - some missed the mark. A bit of levity in a serious situation can make it all the easier to deal. I don't know that "he's right" but I certainly wouldn't call him socially unacceptable. If his personality is a mismatch to yours and some others than that is the way it is. That doesn't mean he's wrong or bad.Why are you offended by his jokes when you know they are simply jokes? Are the jokes very racist and demeaning or are they like a good ribbing that point out little truths? You need to be able to laugh at yourself and if you can't laugh at yourself don't blame him.

Sarah
btw, A Really good family friend that my husband and I have known since we were teenagers was always cracking jokes and telling stories. Well Now he is a Prime Time DJ in Northen California. We keep in touch often and its HILARIOUS to see all the new stuff he has come up with. How he can take the mundane, the sad, the gross, the taboo, or whatever else and make it accessible is amazing. Humour has that capacity, and I would not try to censor that... even if a few jokes rubbed wrong.

Sarah
Sorry - One more thought - The internet is a fickle friend at best. There is absolutely no way that I would ever suggest anyone change their style over the loss of a few online aquaintances even If I was one.


DearBubbie
Great points, Sarah. Joan Rivers has joked about suicide, even though that was the most difficult thing she ever dealt with. She also joked about 9/11 widows. She says humor is a defense mechanism in ways.


Sarah
Sure Is - About 10 Years ago I had a Miscarraige when I was 4 months pregnant - I laid in that hospital Bed Cracking Jokes. My husband and My Mother thought I was crazy. But if I had stopped laughing I would have crumbled. It's just how I managed to Cope until I felt comfortable to grieve."If We couldn't laugh, We would go insane"

Therese
As Abby Hoffman was known to say: Sacred cows make the best hamburger... Either it's all funny -- offensive, insensitive or not -- or nothing is.Humor is how we deal with tragedy, with life, with everything. The alternatives are despair and rage. Life is too short to be intolerant and laugh less. I have been told more times than I can count that I should try stand-up, and every time I hear that, or the sound of laughter (or ire) from someone who has listened to me rant, it validates my coping mechanism of choosing to see the humor in life despite the challenges and suffering and pain that is so apparent everywhere I look. Honestly, it keeps me sane. My thought is: encourage your friend and support him in his efforts. Nobody every died from laughter. There is good energy in that.

DearBubbie
Dear Friend, There is some comedy I simply don't like. Thus, I won't read it, listen to it; I'll change the channel, defriend, etc. . .but I would defend anyone's RIGHT to say whatever they want. If someone is NOT getting the response/reaction - I think that would encourage them into going into a different direction. But it seems that just like there are different types of people, there are different types of comedy that will have an appreciative audience. I would be an honest critic with my friend - if you don't like a joke, don't laugh. If you're offended, let him know. But, it's ultimately HIS choice what comes out of his mouth. I didn't like Howard Stern for the longest time. But did like his movie and book.

Lisa
America has become the land of the offended. It is the intent behind the words that is more important than the words themselves. "four letter words" and other offensive words have only become so due to society attaching a deeper or alternative meaning. They are just words. I tell blonde jokes all the time to my blonde daughter (who is 14 this month) and she thinks they are funny. Why -because she knows the intent behind the jokes. As for your friend- if it doesnt bother him that he is loosing friends why it is bothering you? If you are offended by a certain joke tell him and move on. Life is too short to be worried about jokes.

Kate
I wish we could all laugh at each other a little more. I’ve often said, “If you can’t laugh at your friends, who can you laugh at?” We all need more humor in our lives!

Philip
I don't understand people who are always offended. I don't grasp the context. Either something is in good taste or bad taste and that depends upon each persons tastebuds. I find people who are always "offended" don't seem to like very much. Am I wrong?

DearBubbie
You know what I just thought about. . sometimes the things that I feel are the most HARMLESS posts or words, can cause the most controversy and offense. I have never been a fan of put-down humor - I feel it can be passive-aggressive - but one DOES need to laugh at oneself. No, you are NOT wrong, BubbaBubbie Phil. How about this? When we may
tell a joke and someone gets upset. You tell them you didn't mean it THAT way, and they say: "Oh YES you did!!!" Those are the people I don't like very much. . .

Michael R.
I am usually the first to stand up AGAINST "political correctness", as I feel it has gone too far and has replaced common sense in the arena of humor and general conversation.As adults especially, I don't feel we need anyone policing our language.
That said, I know there are a plenty of goofballs out there who have no sense of what's appropriate, funny or risque. I don't know if your friend falls in the latter category, but if he does, I would probably de-Friend him on FB too. As for him taking his show to the stage, that's for only him to decide. If he's funny, the audience will let him know...immediately. If he's not, he will probably leave the stage and re-evaluate his schtick. I have a friend who is just borish and loud, who thinks he's hilarious. Everyone around him knows he's not, and the result is that he finds himself alone most of the time.If a person can't figure out what's socially acceptable or offensive by the time they reach adulthood, they don't deserve the company of others.Period.

Chris:
I have to agree with Michael on most of this whole issue. I will give you a personal example. My 19 year old step daughter's new Father in Law decided it was fun to send "pornagraphic" type joke text messages to my husband (his Daughter's FIL, for crying out loud... who she is living in the same house with) After the second one, that offended him enough to show me and ask me what he should do, he decided to just send a message back that just said, "please do not text me any porn jokes or pics on my phone." Instead of an apology or even just an ok... the FIL's reply was, "some people just can't take a joke."
Now granted, there are probably some people that were happy to get his little "joke" sent to their phones. My husband is not one of them. Second of all, he worked at a college around young girls where if that joke were accidentally forwarded or seen on his phone, it could have cost him his job. Thirdly and most importantly, it was offensive to a man who has ONE child, an only daughter, who is respectful of women... and it concerned him with who she was living with. This FIL hardly knew us, and yet in his mind it was an appropriate joke.
And then WE were the ones that offended him when we said something negative about it. Not only was this the start of "defriending" type activity... the FIL made it a wedge between my husband and his daughter (who again lives in this household with her new husband).My husband has an excellent sense of humor, but very rarely does he use any "foul" language to tell a joke or to be funny. Sometimes his stories or jokes are not that funny.... to me... but that is ok, we understand each other! Like Michael says, there are so many people out there that just don't have any idea that they are inappropriate. There is a time and a place... and some things are better off not being joked about. I like his suggestion.... go for a night on stage and see how funny this person really is.

DearBubbie
Excellent, Michael! I knew someone like that as well. . the key word being "knew". I personally have been sensitive to jokes regarding the oil spill. There's nothing funny, in my opinion, about the suffering that is taking place due to greed. Then, I heard this joke today: "They figured out a way to stop the oil spill!" Me: "Oh no, is this a joke?" Him: No joke. They're going to clamp a wedding ring on the pipe so it won't 'put out' anymore." (I thought that was funny. . .)

Deb
laughing at everything is called deflection....one is never engaged in the moment, he is always defecting away from real feelings. It's hard to ever take this person seriously, so they do it in a hurtful manner that really gets your attention. Toxic.

Robb
Laughter is good for the soul... Even if your friend's jokes don't always 'hit the mark,' at least the effort to LIVE, LOVE and LAUGH is part of their life! Take note (and don't take it ALL so seriously!)~~~Sometimes the laughter keeps you (or them) from crying! Other times, you GOTTA laugh to keep from cryin'!

Therese
wow. trying not to take a post too seriously. but it ain't easy...of the many things that have been said to me about my sense of humor (or about funny people or humor in general), which is the frame through which i personally choose to view even the most dire circumstances (and including, of course, the most appropriately joyful and legitimately humorous) i have NEVER been called toxic or told my humor (or that having a sense of humor in general) was toxic. i have NEVER been told -- even by therapists and medical professionals in the field of psychology or psychiatry -- that i was "deflecting".
if anything, i embrace every moment of life and thus my humor flows.my personal brand of humor is IN RESPONSE TO the moment and stems from embracing my "real feelings". my humor, (and the humor i witness in general), doesn't denigrate, but rather it uplifts energy, illuminates, illustrates, bonds together. when people can laugh together it establishes a common ground. i would submit you should interact with funny people on a personal level before you write us all off as toxic. abusers are toxic. alcoholics are toxic. crack-heads are toxic. liars and thieves are toxic. buddy cracking a joke about a situation or life experience or political gaffe or the dang oil spill, as tragic and horrible as THAT is, is trying to bring levity. more light less heat. that sort of thing.like i said before life is too short to not laugh. hope you share some good ones today with folks who make you smile my friends. peace out.

DearBubbie
I love my retail neighbor (the other one). . .he always laughs like I've told the funniest joke in the world. His reactions actually catch me off guard, because I didn't think the jokes were that funny. :-0

Chris
I came back to read through this thread again including what Therese just posted. I think everyone has valid points. Just my opinion Therese... the humor you describe yourself having (and knowing some of your background from earlier Bubbie posts) is much different than someone that is obnoxious with their humor. I think Deb's post was geared towards that kind of jokester... maybe I am wrong, but with a written post sometimes things get read out of context. The reaction you are having to that post is similar to a reaction someone else may have of a distasteful joke.
I have encountered a few people that I would have to agree with Deb on. They are obnoxious, toxic, distasteful...all of the above. But I have many friends with tremendous humor and they find humor in everything, that I absolutely adore and laugh at just about anything they put out! Now, if we look at sarah's example, when she miscarried. Laughter got her through it and made the pain bearable. BUT, what if another person was making those same jokes towards Sarah about her miscarriage? Even the same exact words that were coming out of Sarah's mouth?? I don't think anyone would find that funny. And , you know what... there are people like that, and Deb is right... they can be toxic.
I have to be careful with my sense of humor (inherited from my Dad) as I sometimes have a very dry and "sarcastic" type of humor. Somebody that didn't know me well might think I was being mean to someone that I was joking with. I only use that humor with people that know me very well. There is a time and a place for jokes.The kind of jokes I really hate.... ethnic, hateful towards ANY president, fat jokes, and demeaning towards women or children.... thus I really hate the whole Howard Stern thing. My ex used to watch that show and just hearing that man's voice could turn my stomach and I would leave the room.
We had a thread recently on a woman that was offended by a comment made about blacks. How many of you get emailed jokes that are racial, judge mental against Mexicans, crude jokes about the President, etc and you pass them around? Me... I will usually brush off jokes like that to poor taste and most of the time delete them before I get past the first sentence. Everyone has the right in this country to have opinions about All of those things... but do we really need to pass around demeaning jokes? Having a sense of humor about everyday life and the stresses we are challenged with is a wonderful thing and I wish everyone had it. Most of the time, reading posts on here makes me smile and if something doesn't sit right with me, I look at myself first and ask why.Learning to laugh at ourselves is the best medicine."The person who knows how to laugh at himself will never cease to be amused." ~Shirley Maclaine

DearBubbie
Actually, I'd like a specific example from Deb. Deb - are you there? I'm wondering if you're talking about the kind of jokes I mentioned: Passive aggressive. Actually, Deb is stating a fact that is in psych books, not an opinion, I believe.


Therese
I guess my point is this: i totally respect and understand deb's position, textbook-based or opinion, which is why i responded to it. i don't have to agree with folks to want a dialogue with them, in most cases, the more i disagree, the more i learn from the source. to speak to that, deb's post drove me to look up deflection as psychological theory -- it's gestalt theory, very interesting with that said, her post did provoke some feelings within me that are defensive in nature. theories applied generally scare me, or, as pooh would say "big words bother me" -- even if the applicant is a trained professional. i'm just not one to paint with a big brush and it kinda makes me nervous when i experience it. it's just my nature. it was not meant to personal (other than to me). if it was taken so, i humbly apologize.
i also totally respect and understand chris' position and insight to the dialogue, and i agree. with all THAT said, i return to my original point of sacred cows and hamburgers. either it's all funny or humor is dead. there is even a South Park episode about this, for what THAT is worth in legitimizing my point further. humor is largely personal and like any other expression occurring outside one's head, bound to offend someone. i personally don't agree with larry flynt (hustler magazine) or howard stern (most of the time) or, egad, bubba the love sponge; but i loved lenny bruce and richard pryor and george carlin and eddie murphy and a ton of other comics who in general offended a lot of folks... that's my point, which DearBubbie made earlier, if you don't like it, turn it off -- don't hate or try to define or criticize it or judge it or silence it -- leave it for what it is. what is offensive to one person is hilarious to someone else.with all that said: yay! i'm smarter now thanks to deb because i learned something today. thanks for that. peaceout.

DearBubbie
Oh my gosh, Therese. .I am constantly learning and googling things to get more information from posts that compel me - either negatively or positively. NICE NICE that you explained yourself so there is no misunderstanding that this was personal against Deb. I hear ya and AGREE!

Deb
no offense taken! I think it is key to happiness to be able to laugh at oneself and not take everything so seriously. The way I read the post was this poking fun is non-stop and indiscriminate. This can be hurtful, but when one says so, then it's your fault for taking it the "wrong way". Socially intelligent people know when to joke and when to be empathic. This person sounds like he has no filter. I conclude he has a problem.

Simon
Hmm... what would I say? I say peesha, throw caution to the wind, Damn the torpedos! Talk to him about the offensive ones that you find offensive, maybe he needs to polish those to be more general and less direct?